Typophile - Where does the term "The Black Art" come from? - Comments

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Jhazline_20 — Fri, 9 May 2008 01:32:01 -0700

Edit ( spam )

Yeah Jim! Keep on

Eben Sorkin — Tue, 8 May 2007 00:24:23 -0700

Yeah Jim!

Keep on postin’...

Hrant Investigation?

bieler — Mon, 7 May 2007 09:59:53 -0700

Hrant

Investigation? Lineage? Historical accuracy?

Can’t recall.

Gerald

The Bieler Press
http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

Hi Jim Hardly. I was

bieler — Mon, 7 May 2007 09:57:41 -0700

Hi Jim

Hardly. I was fortunate enough to see your book at Richard’s table during CODEX. Very impressive. If my sales would have been much better I’d have picked it up for sure.

A little posting blather is not something to be all that concerned about.

The Bieler Press
http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

I wonder what Wiesenthal’s

hrant — Mon, 7 May 2007 06:35:04 -0700

I wonder what Wiesenthal’s motivation was...

hhp

Yeah, Gerald, I have come to

jim_rimmer — Mon, 7 May 2007 06:26:34 -0700

Yeah, Gerald, I have come to realize that I am also dated.

You will have no further bother me.

Jim

Kris Oh yeah. To get back to

bieler — Mon, 7 May 2007 01:01:43 -0700

Kris

Oh yeah. To get back to you. No, the “black art” is an obsolete term. It would have originally referred to printing in some regard rather than type design.

Type wasn’t even referred to as such until the early 18th century. Moxon never used the word type, he called them letters. And just who would have qualified as the first “type designer”? Schoeffer or Griffo or ?

Gerald

The Bieler Press
http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

Hrant Yeah, this is from

bieler — Sun, 6 May 2007 23:43:12 -0700

Hrant

Yeah, this is from Simon Wiesenthal, “the Nazi Hunter,” in his writings on Columbus.

Columbus was a converso, so had affiliation. I have a copy of a map he drew of the New World (the first) that was sent to his son, with the special code “sign.”

But I was in error, while the “uncoverted” Jews were expurgated in 1492, the Inquisition in Spain began twelve years earlier.

I’ve never been able to find the connection but it was suggested once that the trial and execution of Joan of Arc 1431 had some kind of impact (socially/culturally) on the development of printing.

Gerald

The Bieler Press
http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

A bit back dated Jim. There

bieler — Sun, 6 May 2007 23:12:13 -0700

A bit back dated Jim. There have, ahem, been recent developments in the research.

Gerald

The Bieler Press
http://BielerPress.blogspot.com

“ITU probably isn’t the

jim_rimmer — Sun, 6 May 2007 16:27:58 -0700

“ITU probably isn’t the best source.”

“We [Bureau of Education, International Typographical Union] are indebted to the research work of John Clyde Oswald, Bruce Rogers, Walter Dorwin Teague, William Edwin Rudge, Douglas C. McMurtrie, Walter C. Blelock, Henry Lewis Bullen, Wallace Rice, Gustave Enald Hult, N.J. Werner, Metropoolitan Museum of Art, The Inland Printer, The American Printer, and the Bulletin Official of Paris, for the material appearing in the first three lesson bearing on the history of the art.”

(but not such a bad source, all considered)

Jim

All very interesting, thanks

kris — Sun, 6 May 2007 14:58:15 -0700

All very interesting, thanks folks. Would the “public” consider printing to be the black art these days, or would type design be more of a contemporary black art?

—K

Eben, pay attention man - he

hrant — Sun, 6 May 2007 11:33:20 -0700

Eben, pay attention man - he means Jews!

hhp

Tell us! :-) A printed

Eben Sorkin — Sun, 6 May 2007 11:31:41 -0700

Tell us! :-) A printed bible? A press?

Robert The Inquisition, in

bieler — Sat, 5 May 2007 21:36:06 -0700

Robert

The Inquisition, in Spain, began in 1492, an interesting date don’t you think? The day Columbus sailed all Jews had to be out of Spain. Guess what he had on board?

Gerald

Jim ITU probably isn’t the

bieler — Sat, 5 May 2007 20:56:29 -0700

Jim

ITU probably isn’t the best source.

A bible prior to printing would have cost the equivalent of 1.5 million dollars in today’s money. They were only available to nobility and the church because no one else had any money whatsoever.

The development of Western printing also did two other things. Immediately, the block book was introduced, which provided access to whoever who wanted at a very low price. Which resulted in the decline of printing as represented by B42 and the Mainz Psalter. Also, it raised the price of the manuscript book (“scribal work”), which became the high end in the market for over a century. It did not in any way immediately eliminate the work of the scribe.

The dubbing of the Black Art thing, is really questionable. Printers were thrown into prison and executed, along with any others who violated the laws of the time. Very little to do with the devil, unless you were in Spain or France. Then it hardly mattered what your crime was.

Gerald

Where does the term "The Black Art" come from?

kris — Sat, 28 Apr 2007 23:04:02 -0700

Is there any original reference to the term? Who made it up? Does anyone still use it?

—K