now? to scan?

by the way, there's a tv show, "she wrote murder" or she....something. i don't know.....and the titles - with this typeface....



David Hamuel

The "Murder She Wrote" font is here:

http://simplythebest.net/fonts/TVshow_fonts.html

it's called Lansbury.

I don't think this sample came from a digital font per se,
but maybe a stamp or some type of handpress, with
letters based on some of the typefaces David mentioned.

That might account for why some of the letters are a bit different,
in shape and tone, as Stephen pointed out.

bj

and here's the image from the TV show.

double

It smells like an early 20th century British metal face.
(And font can have alternate letters, you know.)

hhp

here

Thanks bj. I started my day - 5am......so more samples......not now. pleaseeee




David Hamuel

URW's version of Art Gothic contains several alternate characters that better match your sample Jared.

Precision Type has a version. Versions/clones from defunct foundries are out there as well.

Art Gothic appears in the Victorian section of the Solotype Catalog.

Stephen, I'm sure that you are correct, but I'm left wondering about a few things then:

1. Did metal type not contain alternate characters in a set? I know nothing about this, but noted that just the small sampling of Art Gothic in the Solotype Catalog contains two very different 'e's.

2. Could printing methods account for some of those variations, especially varying stroke weights?

3. When we see old type samplings (like Jared's apparently) that seem to mimic very old tyepfaces .... I don't know ... I guess this isn't a question. I'm just trying to picture what actually was being done. A lettering artist sitting and copying a printed sample next to him/her? With those handwritten variations we note

A few minutes distraction from composing my prior post and my questions have partially been answered in the interim.

Ya gotta be quick here.

Metal type totally has alternate forms. In fact Gutenberg himself relied on alternate forms very heavily.

hhp

Thank you for the info guys.

Don't forget film type, Mike. Metal isn't the only other printing method for type. I think most of the stuff in the Solotype Catalog is film type, because of the manipulations that were shown in the back of the book. Many of those tricks are done using film. Between the late '50's(?) and early '90's I think film type was used for a great deal of display and general typesetting, until digital type began to become widespread.

Metal, dry transfer, computer

Here is one link to a bit about Photolettering, another name for film type (as well as the name of a company that was one of the leaders in producing the typefaces): http://www.tpub.com/content/draftsman/14263/css/14263_273.htm

online resources - no. but info, history etc., - yes.


call it Phototypesetting or Photocomposition (and erroneously - "cold type")





David Hamuel

Thanks for the link Mike. I found precious little online using any of yours or David's pertinent terms in Google (even adding 'typography' to thin out false unwanted hits).

I did learn some, though. I gather that individual letters of a typeface still had to be physically placed in a machine

Mike said:"I did learn some, though. I gather that individual letters of a typeface still had to be physically placed in a machine

Aha. Thanks for that clarification Mike.

In the little info I found online, I clearly had made some false assumptions and linked bits of info incorrectly.

Your explanation of photolettering makes some of the comments in the Solotype Catalog, especially about tweaking jobs optically, make more sense now.

Again, I'm going to see what the library has to offer. Images of equipment and technique would be informative and fun for me to see.

Mike,

look for:

* Herman Freud - Intertype Fotosetter, a first-generation phototypesetting system ( 1946).

* Louis Moyroud , Rene Higonnet - second-generation phototypesetting system (1949)


The basic idea/principle:

1. spinning disc + negative images of the typeface (to wit - letter is white. disc - black)

2. lens turret - for the type size.

3. prism - establishes type position (the letters can be condensed, extended etc. etc etc.)

4. paper or film






David Hamuel

Thanks David.

I've written the titles down (decided to use the hand printing system).

Hand-drawn.

I'm not so sure, Stephen. It's not Greeting Monotone,
that's for sure.

Hey, but now I understand what this all means, Jared!
I recognize this sample! You're reopening the case of
a slew of unresolved IDs in an effort to get them IDed
eventually! Am I right?

Visual proof?

I'm sure you can find a similar style in font form, but those
'C's and 's's are too different for me to believe this sample
was from a font.

For all these 13 ID's a very-near-miss is pretty much as good as a hit, if you have any candidates to suggest.

Posting old IDs? A good idea, but Yves, I think you might be delirious. Or much like the leopard, who, upon seeing all the gazelles run in different directions, is not sure which to attack first.

You guys are awesome! An inspiration to the rest of us.

David, this is elefanta? From Solotype?

Mike - A partial answer for you: before 1960 (or so) it was
common to see display lettering done by hand, simply
because in many instances it was cheaper and quicker to
pay an artist to draw the letters than it was to procure
metal or wood type to print them. How times have changed!

The glyphs I refer to when I see signs of hand-lettering are
the UC 'C's and the lc 's's. But now I'm coming to the
realization that these samples are just too poor to get an
accurate reading on their method of printing. It's just as
likely, as others have said, that this comes from a metal
press with slight inconsistencies from ink and impression.
The images are also poor scans, or photos, or whatever
they are. It would help us all in this endeavor if we had
more information about where the samples came from.

1. art gothic (solotype)


2. elefanta - type foundry - Karl Brendler & Sohne. old typeface- art nouveau



David Hamuel