need fraktur suggestions

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need fraktur suggestions
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I'm looking for examples of frakturs that are monospaced, and also ones that are monoline or low-contrast. Any pointers appreciated.

—ℭ

Riccardo Sartori's picture
Joined: 13 Jul 2009 - 4:20am
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I don’t know about monospaced fraktur (maybe there’s a revival of some typewriter face out there, there are for Irish ones).
As for low contrast, just the first ones I came up with:
http://www.underware.nl/fonts/fakir/
http://www.type-together.com/index.php?action=portal/viewContent&cntId_c...
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/thometz/hefeweizen/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/resistenza/afrobeat-gothic/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/doubletwo/xxii-blasphema/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/hubertjocham/keks/

Assuming you mean fraktur in the broader sense of blackletter,

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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There was a monospaced Old English for the IBM selectric typewriter
No digital but you can see the problems of compressing and simplifying some of the upper case letters.
There were also Fraktur typefaces on some German pre WWII typewriters. One of these has been digitized, in a fairly rough form, by Volker Busse as F25 Blackletter Typewriter http://www.dafont.com/f25-blacklettertypewriter.font
A Fraktur typescript from another source

Don

Joshua Langman's picture
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Joined: 14 Nov 2010 - 12:22am
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Almendra Display, a monoline blackletter.

-'s picture
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Actually I'm looking for a fraktur specifically. I find blackletter strangely beautiful (I say "strangely" because typically I admire legibility, and blackletter tends away from that ideal) but I have real difficulty classifying them into one of the four major families. (And then there are modern blackletters, which sometimes don't fit into any of them!) Part of my hope is that by looking at designs with certain constraints (like the monowidth or monoline mentioned) then I would better be able to identify the elements that are essential to that style. I'm still trying to learn about their history, as the difference between historical and contemporary letter forms, for example, still throws me. It can be hard to compare apples to apples.

Furthermore, I like to include a healthy range of math symbols in my own designs, and I'm never able to make fitting ℭ/ℌ/ℑ/ℜ/ℨ because I don't understand them.

All that said, I'm looking for blackletter specimens to study, starting with fraktur. If someone has developed their own mnemonic system for quickly classifying blackletters, I'd be all ears.

Riccardo Sartori's picture
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As an exercise, I [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Dieter_Steffmann|tried]] classifying all of Steffmann's blackletters that are [[http://steffmann.1001fonts.com/blackletter-fonts.html?page=1&items=50|listed]] on 1001fonts.

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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Don't want to rain on the parade but I have compared an assortment of Mr. Steffmann's fonts with digital fonts created earlier by others and found that -- after standardizing the glyph sizes -- the digital outlines were point for point identical. The only differences being that he had added some glyphs to make the fonts more complete. I didn't compile a comprehensive list, but some specific ones are in posts to the font ID forum -- which unfortunately is not indexed.
Don

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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You might find it helpful to read some books on Fraktur. There is a fairly comprehensive collection of Fraktur in Judith Schalansky's _Fraktur Mon Amour_ available from many sources including US Amazon http://www.amazon.com/Fraktur-Mon-Amour-Judith-Schalansky/dp/156898801X
There is an excellent study of the social context of Fraktur in Peter Bain & Paul Shaw's _Blackletter: Type and National Identity_ http://www.amazon.com/Blackletter-National-Identity-Shaw-Bain/dp/1568981...
If you can read German Albert Kapr's _Fraktur: Form und Geschichte der gebrochenen Schriften (German Edition)_ http://www.amazon.com/Fraktur-Geschichte-gebrochenen-Schriften-German/dp...
Don

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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For what is in effect a digital encyclopedia of Fraktur see the fonts digitized by Gerhard Helzel http://www.fraktur.biz/ For some comments on Mr. Helzel's project see the following web page by Luc Devroye http://luc.devroye.org/fonts-23582.html
Luc Devroye also has an extensive web page on Fraktur http://luc.devroye.org/fraktur.html Many hours of useful reading with links to samples and specific fonts.
Don

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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You mentioned Math Symbols. Karsten Luecke designed a legible regular and bold traditional Fraktur alphabet for this purpose for inclusion in the Brill Typeface http://kltf.de/kltf_seen_brillfraktur.shtml and http://www.brill.com/about/brill-fonts
For a discussion of the math symbols in the Brill typeface see http://typophile.com/node/95991
Don

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Herr Steffmann has made no secret that he often "merely" adds accented chars to PD fonts. I simply used that collection for this exercise because it was the first name to come to mind when I thought "blackletter collection".

And thank you for all the links to resources.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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So could somebody edit his Wikipedia entry so it doesn't say "has created over 350 fonts"?

hhp

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That document is in the "draft" space; it's not a real article. The "created" language is what is used by 1001fonts.

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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I have not checked all of the digital sources for Mr. Steffmann's "created" fonts, but I have found ones that IMO the fontmaker who made them from non digital sources did not intend that the fonts be considered public domain fonts that could be edited and redistributed by others without permission.
Don

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If you want to discuss the legal status of Herr Steffmann's fonts, please start a different thread. This one is about learning about identifying, classifying, and designing fraktur.

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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No I don't want to start a discussion about Mr. Steffmann's fonts. It could be endless. I was merely responding to your post that
---start quote--
As an exercise, I tried classifying all of Steffmann's blackletters
---end quote---
and your link to a wiki webpage that claimed that he had "created" them.
I will say nothing more about the topic unless his fonts surface again.
Don

Florian Hardwig's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2007 - 6:41am
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For a contemporary monolinear (but not monospaced) Fraktur, see Rostrot by Georg Seifert:

This modernized blackletter started out in 2006 as a graduation project at the Bauhaus-Universität Weimar. Georg Seifert tried to answer the question how Fraktur typefaces would have looked like today, if they hadn’t fallen out of fashion. In Georg’s hands, the old Teutonic letterforms had to undergo the same stylistic shifts and transformations as Roman typefaces did: less ornamentation, a simplified construction, and a drastically reduced contrast. The result is a “grotesque” monolinear blackletter, Rostrot, and its “seriffed” sister style with some contrast, RosenRot. The fonts were never officially published, but come bundled with Judith Schalansky’s book Fraktur Mon Amour. — Fonts In Use

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Rostrot seems very nice! Wish there was a general-release version.

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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Florian, thanks for mentioning Rostrot. I had seen promos for Grimms Märchen ohne Worte by Frank Flöthmann before and wondered whether there was a full alphabet of the font used on the cover.
As far as I can determine Rostrot was not included in the CD of fonts bundled with Fraktur Mon Amour http://www.fontblog.de/picts/FrakturMonAmour.pdf
Unfortunately, I no longer have access to Fraktur Mon Amour. Was the full alphabet printed in the book? Is it possible to show a specimen here?
Don

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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O.K. with some digging I found this

Answers my question.
Looks like a generally successful design concept for a monoline Fraktur.
Most letters , particularly the lower case, except for the usual problem with _k_ and _w_, would seem to work well for readers unfamiliar with Fraktur. The uppercase resolves some problems, but still has ambiguities for readers unfamiliar with Fraktur. Some examples: _D_ and _O_, _K_ and _R_, _C_ and _S_. BTW, _G_ would make a good logo for Twitter.
In my opinion, for whatever it is worth, the font could be improved if it provided some alternate versions of the problematic letters. Unlike most Fraktur, this one could work particularly well in low resolution situations.
Don

Florian Hardwig's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2007 - 6:41am
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I should have been more specific: Rostrot and RosenRot came bundled with the second edition of Fraktur Mon Amour.
At least Rostrot Statisch has alternates for k and y (not for w, though):

Donald H. Tucker's picture
Joined: 13 Dec 2012 - 3:47pm
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Thanks Florian. Alt _k_ looks good.
Don