Freestyle Remix Challenge

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Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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A lot of good stuff - I'll try to catch up for real tomorrow.

But if a second challenge is desired, there's always my post
of "2005-08-25 22:34" concerning a certain infamous "d"...

Yet another one might be the lc "f" in the original metal Sabon
Italic - one of the worst glyphs ever made in any parallel universe.

And then there's the "a" and "r" in Stone, with their sickly, cloying
terminals. Those deserve a public flogging with a looong composing stick.

Or somebody can suggest something else.

hhp

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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I have another one:
The “d” in Perpetua.
But it would be too easy making it totally mainstream, so what would be cool is if it were made to keep some level of idiosyncracy.

Here my Perpetua d

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Anybody can move on whenever of course, but I'm wondering:

Should we call the Matrix "g" challenge complete as an exercise, or should we polish the best candidate to a finished state, and maybe even end up with a public "font" with just that glyph in it for owners of Matrix to sub in as desired?

hhp

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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> my Perpetua d

Hey, that's a nice surprise!
I would never have thought of that.

hhp

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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>Should we call the Matrix “g” challenge complete as an exercise, or should we polish the best candidate to a finished state, and maybe even end up with a public “font” with just that glyph in it for owners of Matrix to sub in as desired?

Are we ready to choose the best candidate? If so, which one is the best one? Finally, who will choose?

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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i love alternates! (does there need to be a best one?)

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Well, somebody might say "I think this is the best one", and then we can see who agrees/objects, and then the person with that design might become encouraged enough to finish it, and maybe even put out a one-glyph font. BTW, there's really no reason to limit it to one choice. The only thing I personally think people should mind would be to draw the glyph from scratch and not cannibalize contours from the original.

Personally, I think Kris's is the best so far (considering it fits so well with the rest of the font). The main thing I would change is make the connection between the top bowl and the join a bit thicker.

hhp

kris sowersby's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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Good topic Hrant mate, almost 1000 reads! People are into it.

-> The main thing I would change is make the connection between the top bowl and the join a bit thicker.

Like this?

I don't see anything fundamentally wrong with the Perpetua 'd'. I was rather obsessed with the idea for a while. What about changing other glyphs to match, like the 'a'?

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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> People are into it.

I think about half -Les Grandes Artistes de Notre Ere- are frothing and
fuming though... :-/ It's a good thing anonymous posting is off now.

> Like this?

Looking great.
I'd just make the right side of the link totally vertical.
BTW, that ear is genial - I would've never thought of it.

Also:
I was going to suggest that you loosen the right sidebearing, but then I realized another dimension to this: ideally we want any replacement glyph to be uniwidth with the original. Can you work with that?

> I don’t see anything fundamentally wrong with the Perpetua ‘d’.

Well, chirographers hate it. But of course that is -or at least should be- moot. I however do have a problem with it myself: I think it causes a too-prominent spike in texture. I've actually caught myself stumbling on it during reading. On the other hand, it's certainly an "inspiring" glyph, and has played a role in Patria's "d".

> What about changing other glyphs to match, like the ‘a’?

Heyyyy, now that's an idea. That might result in: a more display-like cut; or actually making the "d" no longer ruin the texture! Go with it man.

hhp

Eben Sorkin's picture
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Joined: 22 Jan 2004 - 4:19pm
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Kris, I just looked at the latest g & I have to say it feels absolutely authoritative. The nice thing about this project is it made me look at the forms in new interestying ways. I am all for another charcter/canididate. I would just assumne somebody else pick it. I am up to my eyeballs in pre-winter ready-making.

> I think about half -Les Grandes Artistes de Note Ere- are frothing and
fuming though

What is a 'Note Ere'? As in 'Not here'? That may be a little too grand. Thats alot of folks to have an interest - let alone a negative one.

I agree about the sidebearing.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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BTW Kris, your terminal isn't exactly like it should be. If you look at the "s" you'll see it's more like an isoceles triangle pushed into the end of a curve. Yours I actually like better, but it's out of character.

> What is a ‘Note Ere’?

I'd missed an "r" - sorry - fixed. Meaning: "our era".

hhp

William Berkson's picture
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Joined: 26 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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Kris, speaking of the Perpetua 'd' and your efforts to bring the effect through a typeface, over on build, Frank Blokland posted this, which does what you were attempting. It is worked out with admirable consistency, but my first impression is that the whole thing really doesn't work. What do you think?

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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It worked for Storm ....

William Berkson's picture
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Joined: 26 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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>It worked for Storm

Thanks for the link. Yes, I like his effort much better. His idea of the slight bifurcation in the terminal of the stems makes it work better. But I suspect those serifs are too skinny to work well in text.

kris sowersby's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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Wow, Antares! That is the sort of thing that I was trying to work out with this (the first two images). It has evolved somewhat, but not to the degree of Antares. Thanks for putting that up William. I was totally unawares.

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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> What about changing other glyphs to match, like the ‘a’?

I think the problem with the a is not so much the bottom but the top. Here a suggestion for the a and the Perpetua d

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Game over?

hhp

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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you're the referee of this one, it seems.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Only the catalyst, always.
Go ahead, propose a challenge!

hhp

Eben Sorkin's picture
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Joined: 22 Jan 2004 - 4:19pm
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Maybe a new thread would be better. Paul - you decide since you a have been nominated.

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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Game over of which one : Matrix, Perpetua?

As suggested by Eben, I'd start a new thread, keep the same name Freestyle Remix Challenge and adding the typeface and the glyph for this challenge. For instance :
Freestyle Remix Challenge - Matrix g.
That to avoid to have two challenge in the same thread.

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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how 'bout if we make this a special interest group if this is going to be an ongoing thing?

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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OK, What’s the next challenge?

André Simard's picture
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Joined: 25 Nov 2004 - 12:11pm
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Oups! I did not see the Special Interest Group was already in use.

Sorry.

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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ok, hrant, give us a new challenge here.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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OK, here you go:
http://typophile.com/node/15175

Maybe less clear-cut, and more restrictive, but hopefully a worthwhile challenge.

hhp

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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So it looks like they finally fixed it:
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/emigre/matrix-ii/

As Tiff would say: Discuss.

hhp

Chuck Groth's picture
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Joined: 15 Sep 2005 - 2:36pm
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interesting...

Eben Sorkin's picture
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Joined: 22 Jan 2004 - 4:19pm
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It is is improved - and bears some substantial resemblance to what we worked on here. I am missing seeing Kris' last version.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Indeed, it would be very useful to resurrect the attempts submitted here.

hhp

Ricardo Cordoba's picture
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Joined: 6 Jun 2005 - 6:57pm
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Why, Hrant, long time no see. Are ya back?