Olicana - On sale now

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Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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OK, got it - plus another relevant article.* One is "Slips of the Pen" by Andrew W Ellis, pp 265-282 in Volume 13, #3 (1979); the other is "Variability in Handwritten Characters" by Alan M Wing, immediately following, pp 283-298. You didn't think I keep this sort of thing, did you... :->

* BTW, both of them were indeed in my index, but I
had searched only for "handwriting"... Dumb 'puter.

hhp

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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Looking very good Nick! Glad to see you ended your writers block after a year :-)

ChrisL

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Thanks Chris, I've been busy with this and a few other families.

I've just realised - Is that another of your groan-inducing puns? ;^P

Nick Cooke

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Including mistakes is a good idea Hrant - these can be inserted in the text using the glyphs palette. There are 8 lengths of deletion lines which can be placed over entire words, and a fair bit of other mess.

Nick Cooke

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Wonderful! :-)

hhp

Chris Lozos's picture
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"I’ve just realised - Is that another of your groan-inducing puns? ;^P"

Only the last part about writers block. I really do think you have done some sweet work on this and that part is no joke!

ChrisL

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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Status update: apparently Tiffany does have access to those articles.
"When you have time, Tiff." ;->

hhp

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Here's some more swash lower case characters to add to the mix:

Nick Cooke

Tiffany Wardle's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2001 - 11:00am
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Looking fun, Nick. I can see what you mean about the swashiness getting out-of-control. Perhaps you could do stylistic sets with increasing amounts of swashes? The swashy lc does work with the swash UC better than without. I still love the entire idea of it and the shapes, swashy or not, are really nice. This looks hand-written to me. Fun!!

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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I've been thinking about these and I think they are too much. It's starting to look a bit silly. A bit of restraint is needed. I'm going to re-do them to rein them in a bit.

I noticed the first post of this thread saying I'd finished the Rough style - Ha! what WAS I thinking?

I'm glad you think it looks hand-written. That's what I was trying to achieve with my first 2 scripts ITC Dartangnon and Gizmo, but I didn't have the technology then.

Nick Cooke

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Here are the new improved swashes:

Nick Cooke

Tiffany Wardle's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2001 - 11:00am
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Improved. :^)

How will you approach combinations such as that in "Dea(r M)iss?" The way the r and M still bump I mean. Will you do a little replacement or are you going to delve that deeply?

How are you going about implementing these? I don't know the technology to tell how to do it, but I'm familiar enough to know that stylistic sets could help you. (I'm being redundant. Apologies.)

A clean and rough version of this would be nice as well. I'll go find my pom-poms so I can cheer you on. ;^)

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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The Dea(r M)iss is easily solved - there needs to be a space between the r and M ;^)

I don't know anything about stylistic sets - I guess I'll have to look into it. I may even have to resort to reading the dreaded manual ;^(

I don't speak Geek so it's pretty difficult for me to fathom.

Nick Cooke

Terry Biddle's picture
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Joined: 21 May 2005 - 1:42pm
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Although, I'm not offering in critcism...just wanted to say that this typeface is GORGEOUS and I can't wait to see it completed!

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Thanks Biddy - that's what I like - positive criticism.

I really don't feel like doing stylistic sets, as there is enough going on there anyway, and who in reality would use every feature? I have been neglecting other stuff which needs urgent attention.

I feel I'm coming to the end of this marathon, so it just needs finishing off now, and with a pdf of instructions for use!

Thanks everyone for your comments, it's good to have feedback on a project in progress. It has been a great help, and has given me some new ideas for making the font better and more complete.

Nick Cooke

Eben Sorkin's picture
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Joined: 22 Jan 2004 - 4:19pm
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I too need to learn aboutr Kerning classes. But from what I understand I agree with Tiff they could save you GOBS of time. Then you might actually have time for the errata.

And like everybody else - I agree it's a sweet face!

It sounds like you got your contexual altrenates happening. Yes?

Murray Crocker's picture
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Joined: 25 Oct 2006 - 10:52pm
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fuck mate this is great! just chuck in as mucgh as possible otherwise mondo wil get his back up! nah just kidding!! the more the better, cos if your going to fake handwriting with a font then you'll want heaps of stuff and a manual cos most designers dont actually know how to use opentype properly!

Keep up the good work mate!

Muzz

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Here's a pdf of the final typeface;

.... or would be. How do I import it?

Nick Cooke

William Berkson's picture
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Joined: 26 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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>How do I import it?

You have to attach it to your first post.

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Thanks William – see above.

Nick Cooke

Tom Lukacs's picture
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Joined: 26 May 2006 - 7:52pm
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Nice work!

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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"finishing off now, and with a pdf of instructions for use"

If you think through the substitutions, alternates and default behavior, and get some assistance with the OpenType programming, instructions won't be necessary. You can definitely add dozens of alternates and ligatures, because I agree those will make this design all the more convincing and fluid, but it's unrealistic to think people will carefully select alternates. Wouldn't it really kick kiester to provide 2 or 3 different "states" or conditions? Consider offering stylistic variations like Formal, Casual, Feverish, Passionate. You set up the alternates and ligatures that create those different effects, and any user can choose which one is suitable for their copy, as a simple OpenType feature choice.

One reason for this is that if you offer all the swash letters as a single option, you get a mess. It's likely to never look very good if all the swashes always appear together; and as you've already noticed, it really looks cool when you judiciously add a few swashes here and there. That would only be possible if you control what happens with each user choice. If you want assistance in setting up OT feature code, I suggest contacting Tal Leming or the House Industries gang; they have done great work setting up automatic substitutions, and I really think this design will be fully realized only with a lot of OpenType enhancement. I really like it, and I encourage you not to try to finish it too hastily.

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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But don't take 14 years either please. ;-)

hhp

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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"Finished" is neither "perfect" nor "good enough".

Hrant H Papazian's picture
Joined: 3 May 2000 - 11:00am
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I was just messin' Carl. :-)

"Finished": Perfect, it isn't, and can't be. But good
enough, it must be, at least in some -important- way.

hhp

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Carl - I was thinking only of simple 'turn this option on and you get this' type of instructions. There are already dozens of alternates and ligatures which don't need to be carefully selected - they are standard replacement ligatures, even the swash variations.

A lot of 'designers' (these are seniors and art directors in London - and I'm not saying that London is the creative hub of the world either) haven't even heard of OpenType. Just that there is a lot of ignorance in this profession.

I'll think about what you say anyway.

Consider offering stylistic variations like Formal, Casual, Feverish, Passionate. – sounds like a good idea.

Thanks.

Nick Cooke

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Yeah, it's not Beorcana, nor do I want it to be my life's work ;^) (It's brilliant BTW Carl, and so's Mundo).

I only started it as a bit of distraction from doing more 'formal' stuff – I just got a bit carried away. One can always add something more. It's knowing when to stop that's the problem.

I thought I had.

Well, Hrant I would say that it's good enough. And I know it's not perfect.

But is that good enough?

Nick Cooke

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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Ah, then you are really talking about a specimen, which I fully encourage. Definitely keep the options simple to use. Looks like we understand the user similarly. It's not just London where OpenType is still a foreign concept. ;) I just don't want you to miss opportunities for each of the options to be compelling, distinct, interesting, memorable, and especially, believable as handwriting. Your design is so vivacious, and there haven't been any really compelling, loose handwriting faces with all those bells and whistles, and yours could be the first one! Again I say, it's worth the extra fuss.

Here are some other names you could consider for different states:

Humble Servant (very regular)
Wish You Were Here (more casual)
To My Dearest (gushingly, yet tastefully ornate, maybe add flowers, birds?)
Mad Genius (violent spatters)
Admiral Bombast (excessive ornate swashes, since sometimes this is what's wanted)
Beat Generation (spatters, fingerprints, coffee rings, etc)

Continue having fun.

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Ha ha! Like it Carl.

But wouldn't a coffee ring be absolutely masssive compared to the other glyphs?

BTW, can anyone tell me on which page I can find Glyph sets in the manual?

Nick Cooke

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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here haven’t been any really compelling, loose handwriting faces with all those bells and whistles, and yours could be the first one!

not to take away from what nick has done here, which is wonderful, but do you really feel this way? Surely [[Dear Sarah]] or [[Ministry Script]] must qualify???

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Of course you're right Paul, I think Carl was stressing the loose.

Nick Cooke

Tiffany Wardle's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2001 - 11:00am
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Nick, did you get my reply to your e-mail?

Terry Biddle's picture
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Joined: 21 May 2005 - 1:42pm
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Man oh, man— I can't wait wait to buy this mofo!

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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"Man oh, man— I can’t wait wait to buy this mofo!"

See? We like it.

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Miss T - No I didn't.

Nick Cooke

Grant Hutchinson's picture
Joined: 10 Jun 2002 - 11:00am
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Nick, be sure to contact me when you are getting ready to ship this beauty. I'm assuming it's heading into the G-Type library, correct? I'd love to give it a push.

Superb work, by the way ... is the smooth version still a go as well?

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Don't worry Grant - I'm sure Joe from FWUK will be in touch soon.

Yes, the smooth version is still a goer, but I've got to finish Houschka Rounded family, Morpeth family and Sovereign Display before I do that.

So don't hold your breath.

Thanks also.

Nick Cooke

Grant Hutchinson's picture
Joined: 10 Jun 2002 - 11:00am
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Oy! That's a bit of work you've got cut out for yourself Nick. I’ll await a note from Joe ... but in the meantime, I’d love to see the rest of the work in progress.

Cheers.

Stephen Coles's picture
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Joined: 14 May 2001 - 11:00am
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There's nothing quite like this, Nick. I'd put it on the fast track while scripts are sizzling.

Blank's picture
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006 - 2:15pm
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I hope this font is available before I start my senior year of design school (next fall.). What you've produced is exactly the kind of script font I find myself wanting—all the goodies of the high-end script fonts, but with a nice big dose of FUN.

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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Hi Y'all,

Olicana Rough is finally for sale through Fontworks UK and Veer.

You may want to see the new sample; TDC2006.pdf at the top to see how it's looking.
I'm on the smooth style now - about halfway through.

Nick Cooke

Scott Hultman's picture
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Joined: 26 Jan 2007 - 11:58am
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I'm just confirming what everyone else has already said, but it's beautiful! I rarely come across a typeface that I HAVE to buy right away - but I just couldn't resist. Congratulations!

Nick Cooke's picture
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Well thanks Scott, I'm glad you like it. Congratulations to you too – you are one of the first to use it!

Nick Cooke

Scott Hultman's picture
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Joined: 26 Jan 2007 - 11:58am
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Any idea when the smooth version will be completed/released?

Nick Cooke's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2004 - 2:29am
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NO idea! I've hit a busy spell right now, so it's on hold for the moment. It was progressing quite fast as I had some so-called 'free' time. I reckon there is still about 2-3 weeks worth of work to do on it, but when that will be I don't know.

Nick Cooke