Papyrus need to be put back in the tomb for a few decades.

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ole sørensen's picture
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Joined: 10 May 2005 - 3:19am
Papyrus need to be put back in the tomb for a few decades.
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Chris Costello's 1983 font Papyrus was a beautiful design and I bought it myself back in the day (when fonts came on 3.5" 1.4 meg discs) it is sad to me that it got so popular as it has no value anymore to me because of the immense saturation. In other words it is good for one thing-blanding.
Anyone else have any thought on the use of overly used display fonts?

gary's picture
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Joined: 11 Jul 2002 - 11:13pm
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"Anyone else have any thought on the use of overly used display fonts?"

Someone will surely come along and use it in a way that makes it beautiful again.

nick cottrell's picture
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Joined: 14 Oct 2005 - 12:47pm
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i feel the same way about Bank Gothic. i think it's a great face with a good history, but is so overused, it becomes distracting. perhaps it's just a result of my own obsession…

a lot of typefaces are overused and i'm sure everyone has their own typographic sh*t list.

------------

nc

gary's picture
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Joined: 11 Jul 2002 - 11:13pm
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I take back what I previously posted.

Remedy.

Michael Wilkie's picture
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Joined: 26 Nov 2005 - 11:05pm
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It may seem naive to use such a pedestrian display face, but it's equally naive to choose a face simply because of its obscure and essoteric qualities.

Type should be chosen based on its relevance to the content. Of course, there is a point where the misuse of a face is so common that it no longer speaks the visual language it was intended to speak. Papyrus is probably one such face, as are Zapfino and several other faces that come bundled on the Mac.

For the record, I recently received an Art Director's resume which was set with Papyrus subheads. One glance and it went straight to the trash.

Reynir Heiðberg Stefánsson's picture
Joined: 19 Nov 2010 - 11:15am
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And that is the crux of the matter. I'm still such a tyro when it comes to picking out type for my amassed fanfic library.

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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The biggest problem with Papyrus is that is one of the faces most often picked by those with the least typographic skill or talent. The odds are, most of what you see of it are garbage in-garbage out.

Reynir Heiðberg Stefánsson's picture
Joined: 19 Nov 2010 - 11:15am
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"You always hurt the ones you love." Didn't an old pop tune put it that way?

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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LOL! Yes! The Mills Brothers used to sing it, among many others.

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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Wow, the Mills Brothers. A blast from the past. They sang the jingle for the FontLab commercials too, as I recall.

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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Now, now. Somebody used Papyrus for the signage on the windows of my veterinarian's office and it looks damned good. Done in a sand color with a grainy texture, too.
Keep it walking with the dead, I say.

Patrick Lee's picture
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Joined: 28 Feb 2007 - 2:08pm
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I guess if they can use Trajan for movie titles concerning space, why not Papyrus :-)

ChrisL

I suppose futuristic science fiction should ideally use typefaces that haven't been invented yet?

Blank's picture
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006 - 2:15pm
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Just today I was thinking that once a business is doing a national ad campaign maybe it’s time to hire someone to design a logo that doesn’t use Papyrus.

Frode Bo Helland's picture
Joined: 26 Feb 2007 - 1:03pm
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Gotham and Archer are definitely in the "me too" category. Sadly.

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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@dunwich

Just tonight I saw an ad on cable TV for a company - don't remember what - logo in Papyrus!

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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"I suppose futuristic science fiction should ideally use typefaces that haven't been invented yet?"

Maybe invented in the CURRENT century at least instead of 2000 years ago?

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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Actually, archaeologists are now convinced they've discoverd the world's first type designer from prehistoric times. Amazingly, they deduced this from a single artifact found near the remains: FontLab Studio Version -3456.0.4.

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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Richard, I'll bet that puppy was really full of bugs!

Russell McGorman's picture
Joined: 25 May 2006 - 10:01am
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I only ever used it once, but that truck is probably still driving around Toronto fixing roofs.

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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>Richard, I'll bet that puppy was really full of bugs!

Actually, it was found to be amazingly advanced for it's time. You could drag 'n' drop any glyph in from outside the cave!

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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OH!, You mean the T-Rex tool!

Richard Fink's picture
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Joined: 25 May 2009 - 10:04pm
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Yes! But let's cut them some slack, after all, Ted *was* very young at the time.
(And I hope he has a sense of humor otherwise I can kiss any upgrades goodbye.)
;)
Let's stop before we hurt ourselves!

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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I always hurt myself ;-)

Kristin Eve Smith's picture
Joined: 21 Dec 2010 - 11:43pm
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Papyrus is making me barf.. others are nice & getting way over-used too... on the Papyrus road--- BlackJack, Honey...

John Savard's picture
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Joined: 23 Nov 2009 - 8:42pm
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"Main Stage" on that techno hip-hop liner should have probably been some extra-bold serif face, perhaps Baskerville or Bodoni.

But Papyrus will continue to be overused for a long time to come. As I've noted, it is the one commonly available typeface that is at once exotic and foreign and also politically acceptable. There is always the chance of another typeface that also fits that niche becoming available enough to provide serious competition. Until then, we will just have to wait.

Charles Borges de Oliveira's picture
Joined: 19 Mar 2003 - 2:21pm
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I've always enjoyed Papyrus. I don't care about trends or over use. To me anything can look good if used intelligently in a design; even Comic Sans.

Eric West's picture
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Joined: 20 Mar 2005 - 8:43pm
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I saw a techo/hip-hop flier set in papyrus. Here.

Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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With Gill and Neuropol.
Strange bedfellows.

Eric M Pitcock's picture
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Joined: 25 Oct 2005 - 8:33pm
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> For the record, I recently received an Art Director’s resume which was set with Papyrus subheads. One glance and it went straight to the trash.

I hear that. I can't tell you how many terrible resumes I've seen. It's funny, and sickening.

Patricia Fabricant's picture
Joined: 23 Mar 2004 - 9:40am
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Comic Sans is so loathed and overused there is a web site about it:

http://bancomicsans.com/

Dav (formlos)'s picture
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Joined: 20 Feb 2002 - 11:00am
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Patricia, Were you aware that the designer of Comic Sans is a fellow Typophile.? :)
Vincent Connare..

Dav

Patricia Fabricant's picture
Joined: 23 Mar 2004 - 9:40am
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No, I was not! But I'm not the one who made a web site about it...

Hey Dav, I have a question for you - what's up with the extra period you always insert before punctuation?

Edit: interesting to learn that he never really intended the font to be used for anything other than childrens stuff.

Dav (formlos)'s picture
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Joined: 20 Feb 2002 - 11:00am
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> Hey Dav, I have a question for you - what’s up with the extra period you always
> insert before punctuation?

Hah, Yea, I think thats just one of my 'monk'esque' fads / spleens :)
( I dont think I even remember where this one came from )

Dav

isaac's picture
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Joined: 21 Oct 2002 - 11:00pm
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But Papyrus is so vesatile! It can be Asian (ambiguously Asian at that), African, Wild West, Outer Space, futuristic, and ancient. Probably even more that I haven't even thought of.

Lauren Engelhardt's picture
Joined: 14 Oct 2005 - 2:24pm
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> Outer Space, futuristic

Maybe I'm out of touch with the space program and the future (?!), but Papyrus doesn't convey either of those things to me.

Ancient, yes. Western, maybe. Ambiguously 'foreign', sure. New Age & holistic, you bet! (That's actually where I seem to see it most -- things like day spas and salons.)

Lauri Johnsen's picture
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Joined: 19 Mar 2004 - 4:11am
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Lauren,

I totally agree that Papyrus doesn't say Outer Space at all, but it's still used for those purposes.

Check this out: Serenity poster.

Lauren Engelhardt's picture
Joined: 14 Oct 2005 - 2:24pm
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That Serenity movie poster is odd. I suppose I could see it conveying the 'fantasy' aspect... but not futuristic space rogues. Blech. (I think I may not be their target audience either!)

Wangden's picture
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Joined: 4 Jan 2006 - 3:38pm
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The Serenity poster makes sense if you know the movie or the TV show it came from. A gross oversimplification is that it's a space western, so Papyrus is expressing the "Western" part. (A more complete characterization would be "a character-driven comedy-drama space western".)

[Edit: also, Serenity takes place in a future where everyone speaks both English and Chinese, and the culture is an amalgam of U.S. and Chinese cultures, so Papyrus' "asian" look is also appropriate. Of course, none of this contradicts how overused Papyrus has become, but at least it's not so inappropriate for Serenity.]

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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I guess if they can use Trajan for movie titles concerning space, why not Papyrus :-)

ChrisL

Nick Curtis's picture
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Joined: 21 Apr 2005 - 8:16am
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The real problem is not that Papyrus or Comic Sans are rotten type designs; quite the contrary, they are both well-drawn and suitable for specific purposes. For that matter, Times New Roman is really an excellent, quite elegant text face.

The problem is that, because these faces are included with the Windows operating system, a LOT of people who are utterly clueless about design use them because they're kewl (or whatever) excessively and/or in the most inappropriate circumstances. Familiarity breeds contempt, and excessive misuse breeds nausea, tedium and revulsion.

Peter Gurry's picture
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Joined: 30 Mar 2005 - 12:15am
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What gets me is the

carl's picture
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Joined: 28 Oct 2005 - 4:37pm
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Personally, I've been getting a bit irritated at Suburban.
I guess it bugs me because I liked it the first time I saw it used.

Tim Brown's picture
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Joined: 10 May 2005 - 8:28am
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My brother uses Papyrus as his iChat font and refuses to change it.

Patricia Fabricant's picture
Joined: 23 Mar 2004 - 9:40am
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Here is a really anachronistic use of Papyrus:

http://www.frankjump.com/

It's a great site, though.

Michael Wilkie's picture
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Joined: 26 Nov 2005 - 11:05pm
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Ok, so what are the chances of getting Apple and Microsoft to nix abused typefaces from their default installs? Users obviously can't handle the responsibility of eccentric type.

In a dream world, what fonts would you suggest come installed on consumer desktops?

Robert N. Lee's picture
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Joined: 18 May 2006 - 8:14am
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"Ok, so what are the chances of getting Apple and Microsoft to nix abused typefaces from their default installs?"

My guess is not very good, especially since Apple hated Comic Sans so much they first ripped it off, then just gave in and licensed it.

Chris Lozos's picture
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Joined: 25 Feb 2004 - 11:00am
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Mine :-)

ChrisL

Lauren Engelhardt's picture
Joined: 14 Oct 2005 - 2:24pm
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> In a dream world, what fonts would you suggest come installed on consumer desktops?

Sadly, no matter what you'd pick, it would soon become overused and abused.

Look at the disdain many people have for Helvetica (or Arial) and Times New Roman because they're so "average" and "boring." They're perfectly fine typefaces on their own. But their oversaturation in daily life has made them bland and meaningless to most people.

That leads the everyday user to pick other readily-available/system fonts that are illogical choices like Papyrus or Comic Sans just to try to be different or to add an element of "fun." Eventually, the misuse makes those typefaces just as (seemingly) meaningless.

Edit:
> Familiarity breeds contempt, and excessive misuse breeds nausea, tedium and revulsion.

Yeah, what Nick said! (Sorry for the re-post of the same thought!)

Daniel Weaver's picture
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Joined: 26 Aug 2003 - 4:14pm
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Wait until Courier Flair becomes the sweetheart of 06. You will be clammering for Papyrus Flair. I'm sure someone is working on it as we speak.

Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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In a dream world, what fonts would you suggest come installed on consumer desktops?

One sans family of four, plus a monospace.

Joe Wagner's picture
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Joined: 20 Mar 2006 - 12:18pm
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The font Sand always gets me. Is it ever appropriate?

I have been tracking my encounters with Papyrus here(pops).