Complementary Serif font for Gill?

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David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
Complementary Serif font for Gill?
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Hi,

I'm designing a new corporate id for a housing organisation. The present logo uses the font Gill which i'm not allowed to change. I need a complementry serif font to enrichen the styling options.

Any suggestions?

Tim Daly's picture
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Joined: 11 Sep 2003 - 9:04am
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http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/linotype/joanna/

Joanna is the classic choice for that, you could also look at Swift

http://www.myfonts.com/search?search%5Btext%5D=swift

Tim

John S's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2006 - 3:12am
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Can't agree with timd: Joanna's italic is an absurdly mismatched disaster, and Swift is too spiky and aggressive. Try Celeste, which has just the right delicacy, character shape, and x-height to match Gill Sans pretty well. Also, Josh Darden's Corundum. This is actually one of the harder match-up questions I've seen here.

Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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I matched Gill with Perpetua in a marketing magazine for a bank, and they worked very nicely together for many years. It's a bit of an obvious pairing, but there are some interesting family members in both faces, such as Perpetua Titling, Gill Extra Bold and the Condensed Gills. And Gill Shadow. I had to make a beefed-up Perpetua for footnotes. In all, the typographic palette was quite large, although the Gill figure "1" is really nasty.

Bert Vanderveen's picture
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Joined: 13 Jun 2004 - 8:19am
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Nick wrote: "In all, the typographic palette was quite large, although the Gill figure “1” is really nasty"

There is of course Gill Alternate with a more recognizable 1.

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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Bram Pitoyo's picture
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Joined: 23 May 2006 - 2:18pm
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You know, I'm beginning to see Joanna used in retail spaces (in stores like J Crew and I-forgot-the-other-two), and suddenly Perpetua and Gill Sans Light is cool again. A telltale sign of the Gill revival?

Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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A telltale sign of the Gill revival?

If Gill had designed Helvetica, the movie would be a bit more interesting.

BTW, the word is COMPLEMENTARY. Perhaps we could have a permanent note about this on the Typophile home page, rather like the "NO STAIRWAY" sign in Wayne's World".

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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"Perhaps we could have a permanent note about this on the Typophile home page"

Can we add There/Their, stationery/stationary, and its/it's?

paul d hunt's picture
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Joined: 5 May 2005 - 8:44pm
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Complementary Type: Whitman

Complimentary Type

David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
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Thanx evry buddy, your advise wos verry helpfull; i really appreciated allot ;-D

William Berkson's picture
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Joined: 26 Feb 2003 - 11:00am
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>and its/it’s?

and your/you're

Kids these days.....

David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
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Irony is lost on some people, DOH!

James Mark Hatley's picture
Joined: 13 Jul 2004 - 11:00am
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x2 on Whitman

Lari Elovainio's picture
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Joined: 10 Nov 2005 - 12:05pm
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Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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Pardon me while I belabour the point, as we pedants are wont. Being somewhat of a regular here, I can't help but notice that certain themes and questions frequently appear, déjà vu all over again.~ Hardly a day goes by without someone who has a particular typeface in mind inquiring as to what other face might go well with it, make a good companion, be the sans to its serif or vice versa --in short, as it's usually put, what would "compliment" the face in question.

Might I suggest that as the word "compliment" is rarely used at Typophile in its correct meaning, and that as the said word is invariably proffered instead of the correct "complement", that SmartyPants be instructed to substitute "compliment" by" complement" on these here web pages?

After all, ol' Smarty has a mind to replace hash marks (primes) by "proper" quotes, even though he frequently cocks it up -- I refer of course to abbreviations where a hash mark is turned into a left quote, when an apostrophe would be correct.

So if, at the expense of blowing off the occasional abbreviation, "smart" quotes are deemed acceptable, surely by the same principle of digitally-enabled bowdlerization it would be desirable to improve the spelling to which one is exposed at Typophile, by the same means.

Alexander Kominek's picture
Joined: 10 Dec 2004 - 6:27pm
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The difference is that "smart" quotes are difficult to enter quickly on most keyboards, while "dumb" quotes are easy. Complimentary is just as easy to type as complementary.

- Lex

David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
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Dudes i'm sure you're all lovely people with full and exciting lives, but the original question was about finding a type face that works well will the old man Gill… come guys keep it together, concentrate, i know you can do it… lol

Christopher Timothy Dean's picture
Joined: 22 Oct 2006 - 10:49pm
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I'd have to agree with Nick.

Traditionally Gill is paired with Perpetua.

If it were me, and Perpetua just wasn't working I'd have to go through a standard matching process (x, cap, ascender, descender, width, weight, italic if necessary). I'd still recommend Perptua though. Afterall, it's not the font, but how it is used that is important. A skilled typographer should be able to set a wedding invitation in Helvetica.

Carl Crossgrove's picture
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Joined: 8 Sep 2003 - 2:07pm
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"come guys keep it together"

You're on Typophile, son, this is what you get when you post here. Don't be snapping your fingers impatiently. You already got some great suggestions.

David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
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Crossgrove, i do apologise, my comments were intended to be mildly comical.
I found it funny how this thread evolved into a totally different subject… my wife does that too and i had to laugh. Please don't be offended… i'm Timid&Friendly, i mean no harm ;-)

And i agree the suggestion are fantastmiK

I like perpetua as a classic solution, but i decided i needed something with a more modern edge. I Chose Swift. It has a weighty edgey presence. Plus i already had it and didn't have fork out extra spondolies.

Murray Crocker's picture
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Joined: 25 Oct 2006 - 10:52pm
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Good on yer mate, Celeste is a rubbish font. I am reading a book about Renner a the moment and it is set in Celeste. Spacing is really wobbly and kerning a bit all over the place.

Muzz

Nick Shinn's picture
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Joined: 8 Jul 2003 - 11:00am
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The difference is that “smart” quotes are difficult to enter quickly on most keyboards, while “dumb” quotes are easy. Complimentary is just as easy to type as complementary.

I would say it's more difficult to correctly type the solution to a homophonic dilemma; it's not like simply using a dictionary to determine the correct spelling of a word, one also has to understand what two different words mean, before choosing the right one.

SmartyPants replaces something that is vaguely incorrect most of the time ("dumb" quotes) with something that is patently wrong some of the time (backwards apostrophes).

Here's another one for Smarty: the lower case "i" flanked by spaces is always wrong, therefore it should be capitalized. But what if someone prefers their personal pronoun to be timid and friendly? And what if someone prefers their quote marks dumb?

***

Another choice of face would be Scala, on the principal that Scala Sans is somewhat of a humanist peer to Gill Sans.

David Knowles's picture
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005 - 4:06am
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XD

Bram Pitoyo's picture
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Joined: 23 May 2006 - 2:18pm
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Hmm, actually, if you're looking for a more contemporary solution, try Nexus from the same designer. It's like Scala, but smoother.

Brian Jongseong Park's picture
Joined: 15 Mar 2006 - 12:53pm
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Here’s another one for Smarty: the lower case “i” flanked by spaces is always wrong, therefore it should be capitalized.

But what about passages in the many languages (including most Scandinavian and those Slavic languages written in the Latin alphabet) where 'i' is a fairly common (uncapitalized) word? Take these lines from the Lord's Prayer in a few of these languages.

Croatian: "... kako na Nebu, tako i na Zemlji"
Swedish: "Fader Vår som är i Himmelen"
Welsh: "Dyro i ni heddiw ein bara beunyddiol"

I point this out because Microsoft Word always automatically capitalizes the 'i' when I try to type Swedish. It's the most annoying thing ever. In fact, I am against most attempts at autocorrection in word processors and such, smart quotes being the only major exception.

Mike's picture
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Joined: 28 Mar 2004 - 11:26pm
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I saw Goudy used with Gill Sans on a Junior Scrabble board game box a few months ago.

The headings were set in Gill Sans and the body was set in Goudy. It looked like a nice combination together. The g and the a are similar in letter form too.

Many of the headings were in Gill Sans all caps and the body text was set in Goudy.

Some of the subheadings were set in Gill Sans upper and lower case right into the Goudy body copy (on the same line).

Some other minor subheads were set in Goudy bold.

There was some less important info to the side of the layout all set in a box in Gill Sans: Gill Sans bold u&lc for heading and Gill Sans regulars for the paragraph text.

This combination of Gill with Goudy provided a nice variety of text weight colour to the layout.

I think Goudy works well with Gill Sans.