>"Unfortunately however, sales of font software for Precision Type and many others companies in the font business have been adversely affected in recent years by a growing supply of free font software via the Internet." (From Precision Type's announcement)

Is that really the case?

Possible culprits:

1. Free fonts: bundled with applications (Adobe)
2. Free fonts: with operating sytems (Apple, Microsoft)
3. Free fonts: Freefonts.com, etc.
4. Cheap font collections: Adobe, Bitstream, Corel
5. Pirated fonts: online p2p
6. Pirated fonts: b2b
7. Online competition: mega-stores (Myfonts, Fonts.com)
8. Online competition: proliferation of online foundries and distributors
9. Competition in general: eg Veer's DM + online
10. Product selection.

On this last point, it may be that Precision Type had over-associated itself with foundries (see list on its obituary page) that started out as "wholesale suppliers", but subsequently ramped up their "factory sales" internet activity to become much stronger competitors.

Bundled fonts are typographical "Spam".

I was not familiar with their library when they liquidated, did they distribute any new fonts made in the last 5 years? I was under the imression most of what they were pushing was generally 'old' and very accessable via other distributors, is this correct?

Stuart :D

Also, did Precision Type ever offer online ordering and downloading of fonts? It's not as if this is new technology (Adobe's been doing it for seven years)... seems like maybe they just failed to keep up with the times. Seems like they could have been competing with MyFonts.... But I don't know what their situation was.

T

>Bundled fonts are typographical "Spam".

Good one, Gerald! They are also illegal in many countries, in contravention of "Fair Business Practice", but the authorities are not going after the font perp's, their #1 target is Microsoft -- as with the recent EU fine of Microsoft for bundling other software with its OS.

Here is a section from the Canadian Competition Act, "Offences in Relation to Competitiion":

50. (1) Every one engaged in a business who

(c) engages in a policy of selling products at prices unreasonably low, having the effect or tendency of substantially lessening competition or eliminating a competitor, or designed to have that effect,

is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years.

This is an "anti-dumping" law, which would apply to bundling free software, but as with many things digital, there appears to be a different standard as to what businesses can get away with.

I think they may have given up even trying over the last few years. The fact that they link to Eyewire is a pretty good indication they have not been active in or paying attention to the "marketplace" for a long time.

I think they may have given up even trying over the last few years. The fact that they link to Eyewire is a pretty good indication they have not been active in or paying attention to the "marketplace" for a long time.

Nick,

There is a pretty huge difference between Microsoft's bundling web browsers and media players in their operating system, and other folks bundling fonts with their applications. Among other things, I doubt you'll find folks engaged in font bundling writing notes to each other about how the small type foundries must have their air supply cut off.

I rather suspect that making false public allegations that somebody is breaking the law can get you in trouble. I don't know whether your current comments are libellous. I also don't know how much of a defence ignorance is against a libel lawsuit. I just think you should be a little more careful.

This isn't a threat or anything: even if I was personally ticked off enough to talk to our lawyers, I doubt Adobe would bother with this sort of nonsense. But you're making pretty broad blanket statements, and some folks in the type industry are much more aggressive in their legal activities than Adobe is.

Cheers,

T

Thomas,

Thank you for the warning.

I was incorrect in stating that font bundling is against the law in many countries, because this has not been proven.

So let me just ask the readers of this thread to look at the section of the Canada Competition Act that I quoted, and draw their own conclusions.

Rest assured, I will not be suing any large companies, my pockets aren't deep enough.

Interesting point. I do know many european countries prohibit the selling of a product at a loss to cut the competition out.

Of course, in the US, we don't really care about that (in the legal sense) and let businesses get away with that.

The big issue with digital media, though, is that the cost of replication/distribution can be argued at being close to nothing.

Also, did Precision Type ever offer online ordering and downloading of fonts?

It's been four years since I worked for a company that was a reseller for Precision Type (Beowulf in St. Paul). At that time they sent us several CDs with all their fonts. We'd send a P.O. for the font we wanted and they'd send us a code to unlock the font. We could then e-mail the fonts to our buyers. At the time it seemed speedy!

I use their book often when trying to track down unfamiliar typefaces. However, it's much easier just to post a sample here on the identification board. The speed of responses here is just amazing!

kristin

Tomas, Nick,

I think the temperature should be turned down.

I rather suspect that making false public allegations that somebody is breaking the law can get you in trouble. I don't know whether your current comments are libellous. I also don't know how much of a defence ignorance is against a libel lawsuit. I just think you should be a little more careful.

Kristin:

What was/is Beowulf (asking as a curious St. Pauler...)

Nick,

You were asking about the Canadian Competition Act? I looked at it. I have always avoided this discussion. It seems to get everyones back up. But this is simply hypothetical and for entertainment purposes only.

"Bundling" is not a legal definition, but "tied selling" is.

So here is my "NON LEGAL" opinion about "tied selling".

What was/is Beowulf (asking as a curious St. Pauler...)

Beowulf was a pre-press company that was created out of staff who remained when the company Great Faces was dissolved. Beowulf was located in the Union Depot for a few years and it also went under. Some of the remaining folks were with a firm called GreatGraphix (sp?) somewhere in Bloomington. That company dissolved as well.

Ah...that's where I remember that name! (I used to work in the Northwestern building a block from the Depot...)

*Sigh* I miss working there...

Excellent list of culprits, Nick. I tend to focus on the free font
sites and forget about bundling, which has as strong an impact.