University Final Project

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Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
University Final Project
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I'm in my fourth and final year of a design degree and am working on my final project. The project is a hypothetical, where the advertising industry ('Madison Ave') is feeling the effects of the global recession and is embarking on a widespread advertising campaign. The whole thing is very much anti-advertising, and is designed to highlight how the idea of 'the consumer' is really a product of the advertising industry. [[http://www.danflan.com.au/links/poster.jpg|This]] might give you a better idea of the whole idea, or if your really keen I've posted my brief up [[http://danflan.com.au/madisonave/?page_id=2|here]].

Anyway, although its all early stages at the moment, I'm up to the visual identity bit (small part of the assignment, but pretty important for everything to come), and am eager to get some outside feedback.

Visually, the aim of the identity is to appear slightly detached from the content. I want the logo to be somewhat ambiguous — playfully neutral — and hardly distinguished from a design one might expect from companies manufacturing pharmaceuticals or light-globes. Aside from a few clues, the logo that I have identified doesn’t say all that much about the ‘client’, and isn’t supposed to.

The alternate ideas all had a few issues associated with them (the first one is a bit cliche, the second one doesnt scale well), but have included them here for good measure.

Finally, I know this is probably too much to ask, and of course feedback in any form would be massively appreciated, but I've set up a blog at [[http://www.danflan.com.au/madisonave]] (as an assessable task) to keep track of the project and for this sort of thing so any posts on that page would be appreciated beyond belief,

Anyway, love to hear what you think, criticisms and any suggestions,

Thanks in advance,

Dan Flan

Will's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2008 - 7:14am
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As you appear to be highlighting the illogical i am surprised you have not gone along the lines of highlighting the 'mad'.

Will

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Thanks for the suggestion Will,

It's something that I considered at the start, and then kind of shifted the word Mad to become a smaller secondary mark on its own.

However, highlighting the mad subtly would be keeping inline with the projects concept, so I'll put together a few more designs keeping that in mind,

I feel like just putting a line under the word is a bit of a cop out (and thats probably why I'm not all that happy with the current logo), but any weight, colour or face changes would probably make it a bit too obvious.. Do you have any ideas?

Cheers

Dan

John Leschinski's picture
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Joined: 15 Jan 2007 - 2:04pm
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Is it just me or does that shape scream youtube?

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Picard your 100% right with that call, shape probably needs re-evaluating. The shape is supposed to be a TV screen (I guess that's what YouTube was probably going for as well..)

Although I still like the look of a few of those shapes in series, I would be kind of happy to ditch that shape anyway because making the t.v. association is really pigeon holing advertising to just one type of advertising.

Anyway, putting the shape to one side, and taking Wills suggestion on board, I have put these together as a start,

Love to hear out of these, what direction — if any — everyone thinks is appropriate

Dan

Will's picture
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Joined: 18 Feb 2008 - 7:14am
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just a thought but if you wanted to go really subtle you could generate the mad/ison split simply by intensionally poor kerning - something that only only designers or the artistically minded would spot. not entirely unapropriate for your topic.

Will

Craig Eliason's picture
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Joined: 19 Mar 2004 - 1:44pm
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Some of the latest remind me of the logo for this US television show:

Alex Pankratov's picture
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Joined: 24 Nov 2008 - 11:50pm
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And Madmen's mark reminds me of Maxell's old ad:

Alaskan's picture
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And Maxell's ad reminds me of:

C'mon now, we can do this. Thelma and Louise can't be more than four degrees from Kevin Bacon, right?

Robert Koritnik's picture
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Joined: 30 May 2007 - 5:52pm
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Why not rename to "Ave Mad"... You'd have some duality here as Avenue Madison as well as taken from ancient Roman's greeting "Ave"... Ave Caesar... Ave Mad.

Anyway. I didn't think that the first one resembled Youtube. I very much liked colour choice. But two lines under AD were distracting, because they looked like illegible text under main headline.

From the latest batch I would like to know, what are you trying to emphasize here, because it looks like you can't decide. Is it MAD or is it AD? OR would you rather write "MAD AVE AD" instead... :)

@epsilicon: that really is a great ad.
___________
Robert Koritnik

Steven Wulf's picture
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Joined: 21 Jul 2005 - 3:52am
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Susan Sarandon was in Dead Man Walking (1995) with Sean Penn
Sean Penn was in Mystic River (2003) with Kevin Bacon

Geena Davis was in Cutthroat Island (1995) with Frank Langella
Frank Langella was in Frost/Nixon (2008) with Kevin Bacon

That makes fun...

:)

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Eliason:
I agree with your observation, some of the revised designs are strikingly similar to the Mad Men logo. Out of curiosity, do you think that this is necessarily a bad thing considering their common origins? Is this (originally unintended) pop-culture reference at all appropriate?

Incidentally, Mad Men season 1 is due to air on Australian free to air in the next few weeks, looking forward to seeing whether it lives up to the hype..

Will:
Thanks for your suggestion, I'll give it a go in the next round

Epsillicon:
That ad is amazing, thanks for posting it. He's living the dream

Alaskan:
Thelma and Louise is actually only two degrees from Kevin Bacon. Geena Davis was in Cutthroat with Frank Langella who was in Frost/Nixon with Kevin Bacon

Litera:
I really like your suggestion for the name, and in an ideal world I would probably run with it. However, such an application would probably go over the head of the intended audience. Speaking with people about my project so far, I've found that a lot of people— although liking the name — have never heard of Madison Ave. and those who have often don't make the association with advertising. Being clever with the name like that would almost certainly add to the confusion.

You're completely right about the two lines under AD being distracting and looking like illegible text, thanks for that, I'll keep it in mind with upcoming revisions. And thank you for liking the colours, I'm also really happy with them.

To answer your question, as you guessed, I'm being a bit indecisive, but I think I'm probably more inclined to highlight the MAD as suggested by William. I'm only continuing to highlight the AD to address the above problem of people not linking Madison Avenue with advertising.

What do you think? Have I been speaking to a select few people who just don't get the reference?

Thanks for your words,

Dan

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Joined: 27 Nov 2007 - 8:29am
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I feel like just putting a line under the word is a bit of a cop out (and thats probably why I’m not all that happy with the current logo), but any weight, colour or face changes would probably make it a bit too obvious.. Do you have any ideas?

Have you thought about using small caps?

bobbybobo's picture
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Joined: 27 Nov 2007 - 8:29am
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By the way, I disagree with the mark resembeling youtube.
There a quit a few differences which have their own rights to exist.
The tv-shape – however – becomes out of date with all the new tft and plasma screens.
I like the colors.

Jelmar Geertsma's picture
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006 - 9:53am
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I didn't immediately think of YouTube either. Of course I see the resemblance, but it isn't a problem in my opinion. But the shape doesn't really matter for the typography, and I think it's good that you're starting to develop that independant from the tv-shape. But I wouldn't ditch it just yet because it is slightly reminiscent of YouTybe. :)

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Thanks for your comments and suggestions,

Bobbybobo, I especially liked the small-caps suggestion and had a play with it, but I just couldnt make it work in a way that kept the aesthetic I am going for.

Anyway, I have put together this design,

Would love to hear any further critique,

Thanks
Dan

bobbybobo's picture
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Joined: 27 Nov 2007 - 8:29am
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Hi Dan,
Aesthetically, it looks a bit out of balance.
The line under MAD and the placement of AVE creates a kind of diagonal which pulls it down on the left side.

Some other ideas:

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Thanks heaps for those suggestions, really like them both and decided to run with the one on the right with this next round,

Heres a few ideas typographically,

And with inside the shape,

Love to hear an opinion on these,

Cheers
Dan

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Sorry to double post, but put this together afterwards and thought it might be worth sharing

Dan

bobbybobo's picture
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Joined: 27 Nov 2007 - 8:29am
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Hi Dan.

1A, is somewhat ackward. It is less legible/readable (I'm Dutch, never understood the difference).
My option (of the ones shown) would be 1B.
I like it clean. And it stacks pretty nice.
2A could also be a contender.

What are you trying to do with the line underneath ISON?
You emphasize it, is that what you want?

3A-AVE is very small and I guess it will be unreadable when small and/or printed in difference colours (CMYK).

Ray

Jelmar Geertsma's picture
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006 - 9:53am
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Hi Ray, fellow Groninger ;) Legibility is the quality of a typeface itself, how well you can read it. Readability is how well you can read the design of a piece of typography, so the design of the printed page. Or at least... I think.

bobbybobo's picture
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Joined: 27 Nov 2007 - 8:29am
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Hi Jelmar! So close and yet so far. ;-)

Thanks for your input upon legibility and readability.
Sounds fair!

Nice website, like the sixtypound!

Jelmar Geertsma's picture
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006 - 9:53am
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Indeed, and thanks for the compliment!

And I get legibility and readability mixed up all the time too.

Well, enough hijacking of this thread... ;)

Daniel Flanagan's picture
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Joined: 5 Mar 2008 - 5:22am
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Thanks a ton for your feedback Ray,

Well observed that the line highlights the 'ISON', that wasn't my intention, so I won't be running with any of those on line 2,

It's kind of getting to the stage in the project where I need to finalize the logo design, so I'm making the decision to run with the last ones that I posted (the ones with the block around AVE) — unless anyone notices anything that jumps out as drastically wrong?

Anyway, thanks again for your feedback,

Dan

Robert Koritnik's picture
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Joined: 30 May 2007 - 5:52pm
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Having MADISON written completely in same size letters and putting AVE in negative but vertically at the end?
Maybe?

___________
Robert Koritnik