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I'm working on this new Didone style. It's characterful with high contrast and ink-traps as a feature, tapered stems and a 'bumpy' appearance. I'm not sure about the cap G, but I quite like its quirkiness.
Any comments welcome.
30 Sep 2010 — 9:38am
i like it ; keep going, i already want one!
30 Sep 2010 — 10:02am
Why the ink-traps? It’s ‹bumpy› enough as it is – looks promising. Not sure about the corner ending of the r’s drop though.
30 Sep 2010 — 10:14am
It has that "Kepler-like" style. Very good!
30 Sep 2010 — 11:38am
Two thumbs up!
The serifed thins (upper right of C/G, and maybe lower left of A/M) could use more weight IMO.
1 Oct 2010 — 1:11am
I don't know if this is helpful at all at this stage, but you might want to have a look at Faberfonts' Dagi for a related approach.
1 Oct 2010 — 3:29am
Thanks everyone.
Craig, I have added a bit more weight to the terminals of the C and G.
Why the ink-traps? - They help to create thin strokes and also give 'air' to what would otherwise be a very dense design.
Dagi is interesting Akos, but maybe not so relevant to this design. It reminds me of Stilla.
More samples to follow.
1 Oct 2010 — 9:56am
Here's how it's progressing.
1 Oct 2010 — 10:07am
Is there any bend (e.g. cupping) to those horizontal ends at top and bottom (e.g. terminals of stems, top of T, bottom of L, top and bottom of E)? If not, should there be? They look a little rigid in these images.
1 Oct 2010 — 11:37am
This is a very nice idea.
My feeling is that the long concave sides (caps, ascenders) need some more work to fully realize this design. The right and left curves seem a little different, with the extreme generally being lower on the left, and maybe pulled in a little bit too much. The column of the I seems a little top heavy to me. I'm not saying it can't succeed weighted more toward the top--I don't know--but it feels a little too much now. The difference between the left and right of the "l" also doesn't feel totally right.
4 Oct 2010 — 7:27am
Yes Craig, there is subtle cupping on the T, L and E.
William, the stem curves on the left and right are not similar - intentionally. Having done so many sans fonts with symmetrical aspects I decided that I'd had it with symmetry for this typeface.
4 Oct 2010 — 9:50am
Nick, you may well be able to make asymmetry work. What may be unsettling to me is that it is *almost* symmetrical. I know Matthew Carter, in his critiques at TypeCon, often makes the point that if something is going to be a feature, it needs to look like a definite decision. I do think you can have subliminal stuff that works, but I'm wondering whether if you go further one way or the other it will strengthen it. In any case, it looks good already.
5 Oct 2010 — 3:43am
I'm trying to create a Didone with distinct character that will be taken seriously. I want a look that is formal, but just veering towards contemporary informality. I don't want to go too far down the road that leads to fonts like Nueva and Jimbo, however much I might admire them. I wouldn't want to exaggerate any inconsistencies which may introduce a note of 'cartooniness'.
IMO it looks distinctive enough without any more quirks, besides if it's unsettling it's interesting.
7 Oct 2010 — 8:45am
Here are all the caps and lower case plus numbers.
Looking at it now - are the cap stems heavy enough?
7 Oct 2010 — 9:08am
This is going to be lovely. A few things I wonder. Is there too much space in the top "v" of the "k"? Looking again, I think the asymmetry of the tapers on the caps generally works well. But the H still seems off to me. Is it too narrow? Maybe it should be more straight internally, and/or widened. I feel like the I needs to pull up his pants a bit--the waist is maybe too low. The 5, should the top going into the thin vertical be more like the 7?
On the weight of the stems, maybe the issue on the caps is the relationship between the vertical and diagonal strokes. I don't know of the diagonals should be a little lighter or the stems heavier. With heavier stems you'd probably have to adjust vertical arches...
7 Oct 2010 — 9:47am
I second what Bill said about the /H/ and the /5/.
The thin arms of /X/ may be a little too floppy in their curves.
I'd consider getting a little more white into the counterish interior of the hooks of /J/ and /j/.
In addition to considering widening of /H/, /B/, too, could use a touch more width to its counters, IMO.
Does the shape of the serif of /c/ threaten to be read as an /e/?
I love the upright of /G/, and the tails of /y/ and /Q/. The energy of the lowercase is just delightful.
Have you ever looked at Novarese's Fenice Ultra?
A mixed-case sampling of words would help judge the thickness issue.
7 Oct 2010 — 9:57am
For interest: ITC Bodoni Brush.
7 Oct 2010 — 10:01am
Thanks, some valid points there. I shall amend some characters accordingly.
8 Oct 2010 — 3:27am
Altered characters; c, j, k, A, B, H, I, J, K, M, N, V, W, X and Y. All cap diagonals are thickened, plus more weight on top right of V, W, X and Y.
I like 5 and 7 as they are, the top of 7 goes into the stem with a slight inward curve to compensate for the acute angle, whereas the top of the 5 joins the stem at an obtuse angle so it isn't needed.
14 Oct 2010 — 8:18am
How is this German double s looking? Is that little serif at the top of the x-height on the left of the stem necessary? i quite like it, but it doesn't have to be there does it?
15 Oct 2010 — 3:34am
The spur on the ß comes from old designs of the long-s. As a readability issue it is not necessary. The top stroke on the right is way too thin if it follows a brush stroke.
19 Oct 2010 — 5:20am
I think that thin stroke at the top of the ß is acceptable in the heavy weights of this genre - quite a few have this.
I have been working on other weights, I think 3 would be good:
19 Oct 2010 — 7:06am
I think your light weight loses the charm of the heavy one. I suspect that narrowing the characters will help in the light will help. It may be that even the light should have heavier verticals, to keep the higher contrast. That's an essential part of the Didone look, I think.
19 Oct 2010 — 7:09am
I'll try that.
19 Oct 2010 — 11:11am
You might check out ITC Bodoni in its various sizes and weights as a point of departure for dealing with the different weights.
20 Oct 2010 — 4:08am
I tried it, (ie. more condensed but with bolder stems) and I think it looks better:
It's strange that the blend between the 2 extremes looks almost exactly the same, but the light is significantly different. I must therefore be on the right path.
10 Dec 2010 — 4:55am
I've developed a new Display style of this font (which will probably be called Saltaire). It has much thinner thins for ultra-high contrast.
It's caps only at the moment:
10 Dec 2010 — 8:24am
Funky.
12 Dec 2010 — 7:44pm
I really like some of the quirky characteristics here
17 Jan 2011 — 3:30am
I think I like this new style of K, k better, does anybody else?
17 Jan 2011 — 5:56am
I like it. It almost alone gives a different, softer feeling to the entire typeface. (I would keep the old ones as alternates, though)
17 Jan 2011 — 7:03am
It's great!
17 Jan 2011 — 7:28pm
I really like it also. Have you tested terminal on other diagonals also?
18 Jan 2011 — 4:55am
Maybe the upper diagonal is coming too abruptly?
18 Jan 2011 — 8:44am
Where? what do you mean?
18 Jan 2011 — 8:58am
That K is wanting in the middle, compared to the R. The legs seem somewhat disconnected and the colour is lighter. Maybe you should tighten it (less expansive).
19 Jan 2011 — 3:48am
Make the legs thicker and move legs and arms left towards the stems?
20 Jan 2011 — 12:25pm
Beautiful!
just an opinion - I'm not a type expert or designer. One thing that stands out to me, is the "A" and the "4". The counters look like really sharp geometric triangles, that doesn't match all the curviness of all the other letters. The 4's stem looks somewhat chopped off at the top too.
20 Jan 2011 — 4:52pm
Fun stuff, Nick!
Is the bottom of the g pushed to the right too far?
20 Jan 2011 — 9:02pm
That Q is a beaut.
20 Jan 2011 — 9:19pm
I also noticed the counter on the A being very sharp, but I really liked that.
Do you think a more outrageous more eyecatching ampersand could benefit the typeface?
I feel that the question mark lacks contrast compared to everything else.
The @ symbol is awesome.
This typeface is gorgeous, it reminded me of Aldo Novarese's Normandia (bold and a bit out of the ordinary) would you contemplate a Normandia style numeral 8?
21 Jan 2011 — 2:43am
Thanks.
I don't see how the A could be designed differently. The 4 could be pointier and the question mark a bit thinner at the top. I like the g as it is, but maybe I'll move the top half over to the right a bit which will have the same effect. Maybe a Normande style 8 would be better - I'll try that.
24 Jan 2011 — 9:37am
Here are new altered characters: 4 8 ? and g. I'm quite happy with them and think they'll stay that way.
18 Feb 2011 — 1:14pm
Take my comments with a grain of salt as I'm not a professional. Having said so, I can't help sharing what I see. I think the thin verticals of eight might be a bit too thin, making eight look too wide and slightly lighter than the other numerals. The bottom of 7 is a bit too round for me. Perhaps make one side straight, with a similar approach as the terminals? 2 and 5 really look stunning!
7 Mar 2011 — 4:03am
Hmm... maybe a bit thin on the 8, but I like that contrast. You've got a good eye for a young whippersnapper Jasper! You've been bitten by the type bug very early - I hope you never recover from it!
Moving on... what do the good folks out there think of these K's? I quite like the ball terminal on the arm even though it's slightly out of character with the rest, giving it an almost Cyrillic feel.
7 Mar 2011 — 4:52am
Nick: your overshots could be stronger.
Neither of these are quite there yet: top one is unbalanced, middle one is way better but the angle at which the hairline stroke departs from the leg feels unnatural to me. The ball terminal K has the same issue, and the ball it self doesn't look all that comfortable there. Maybe it's leaning out too far to the right? Maybe it's because it's so vertically compressed.? Have you tried an Ambroise style K where the hairline is bent and curls around the ball terminal, or would that be too much? All-in-all: Of your three samples, number two is the best one IMO.
7 Mar 2011 — 6:40am
I like the ball terminal as going with the leg of the K and R. I'm not sure about the size and placement, but it is better than the serif, which is hard to make big enough for balance without looking awkward. I think it's worth trying the ball terminal on the terminals of other thin diagonals also.
7 Mar 2011 — 10:13am
I like the round terminal, but it does need some adjustments. My eye tells me that the ball is slightly too large and the bottom leg should go down steeper, but that could be wrong. Do you have any idea when this is going to be released?
8 Mar 2011 — 7:35am
Too large? I was thinking that it's maybe too small, or could be a bit rounder.
It may be released this year, but I've a large (paid) project on at the moment which takes priority. I work on my own stuff when I don't have any commissions. Anyway, it's good to leave things for a few weeks or months, that way you have a fresh eye when you return; like spotting if the overshoots aren't big enough :^)
9 Mar 2011 — 11:09am
"Too large? I was thinking that it's maybe too small, or could be a bit rounder."
I could well wrong on that part, but there's definitely something a little off.
15 Mar 2011 — 9:16am
I've altered the K and increased the overshoots