My first typeface "Loose"

Stinger's picture

Not sure if this is the correct place and what the conventions are for showcasing your font, but here we go. I've put together a few files to show the font. The first one only shows 3 weights in more detail but there are in fact 4. I've (hand)drawn all glyphs in illustrator, they are basically monolined and meant to be pretty close to one another. Bold and italic/slanted versions have been generated with the help of FontLab although I had to redraw a number of glyphs (I realise it's probably bad form to have FontLab generate a bold and italic version for you...) Maybe I've put the glyphs a bit too close in kerning, not sure.

Suggestions welcome on all fronts!

some more samples:

more images can be found at my flickr stream: http://www.flickr.com/photos/zeptonn

cerulean's picture

I would straighten up the vertical stroke of K. It seems like the sort of thing that would stand out more the more times you see it, especially in all-caps use. It doesn't need changing in the swash K, though.

eliason's picture

Lower the crossbar of /4/ to give the counter more space.
Top counter of /a/ also looks a little cramped.
Did you consider connecting the crossbars on those ligatures?
I think the swashy cap alternates are out of character.
Bold still needs more cleaning up. Allow it to depart from monoline (for example at the joins) more.
Those "historical" ligatures strike me as a goofy inclusion in a typeface like this. But I like the "Ti" "Tj" treatment a lot.
/Z/ may be wide. /W/ could come up further in the middle. /S/ may be trying to hard to hit horizontal in the spine.
I like the crossbar on /7/.

timaarts's picture

Leuk! Kun je weinig mee maar toch. :-)

timaarts's picture

De a vind ik juist wel tof zo. Maakt het modern.

Bert Vanderveen's picture

@timaarts: Please stick to English in this community. Or provide a translation. [Hou het engels, of geef een vertaling.]

Stinger's picture

great feedback so far guys!

@cerulean: good point about the K, seeing it next to the M like in the bottommost image it's indeed a bit too curvy. I don't want to drop that curviness too much, i want it to stay a little loose. But it could definitely use some work, so thanks!

@eliason: thanks for all those constructive points! the /a/ is definitely a character i've been struggling with. if i move the top part upwards it becomes too high (have tried that before) making it stand out way too much in regard to the other lower cases. I'll have to try out some more options there.

"Did you consider connecting the crossbars on those ligatures?" << which ones do you mean?

I do realise that most of the ligatures might seem out of place since they are old fashioned, but i thought it would be fun. plus, most of them are discretionary ligatures, so people can leave them out. Same for the swash capitals. It's a bit of a tricky decision maybe, since I am in fact including them and then saying "hey if you don't like them you can leave them out". Not sure if that is a good call but as for now I think I'll leave them?

What I currently have as standard ligatures: /ffi/ffj/ffl/fft/ff/fi/fj/fl/ft/tt/Tij/Tji/Th/Ti/Tj/
All the others are discretionary ligatures.
I did one odd thing: i made an alternative st ligature (where the top of the /s/ is connected to the crossbar of the /t/) and this ligature I added as a contextual alternate that supposedly only works at the start of words. Hence in the middle of a word the st is replaced by an old fashioned ligature, but at the start of a word (if users want that) it can be replaced by a different one. Does this make sense at all?

Now that you mention it I see that /Z/ /W/ and /S/ could use some work.

The bold variant is something i probably need to put some proper time in, to make it better. After getting fontlab to create a bolder version I did redo about 1/3 of the glyphs as they were messy. Some more contrast (that is what you suggest I think?) might be good indeed to strengthen the bold effect.

Thanks so far for all the feedback!

And thanks (bedankt!) as well Tim!

eliason's picture

"Did you consider connecting the crossbars on those ligatures?" << which ones do you mean?

I mean having ff, ft, tt share one long crossbar.

Stinger's picture

Hey eliason, thanks for getting back. I did in fact try those option but they looked a bit odd. At the moment the space in between the crossbars might be a bit small, but if I connect those crossbars it had an odd effect. For example, the /ft/ looked like an alternative /A/

See them here:

What do you think?

eliason's picture

Set some words with them to judge whether it works or not.

daverowland's picture

The reason the swash characters aren't working is because they break from the monoline-ness of the rest of the font. Keep the swashes but don't have them tapering to a point as they are now, but keep the basic skeleton and have the ends of the swashes basically the same as the ends of all other stems. Another thing that jumped out at me - you single curly quotes are like 6 and 9, so your double curly quotes should be like 66 and 99. At the moment they are mirrored 99 and 99.
Overall it's looking like a nice alternative to Kristen and (dare I say it) Comic Sans.

Stinger's picture

Thanks eliason will test them out!

And thanks Dave, good point about the swashes, couldn't put my finger on it but as you say, this is what makes them a bit out of style.

Good catch too about the single vs double quotes - my bad!

And yes, after having created the lower case letters (I started out with the upper case letters) I did realise it started to look a bit like comic sans indeed. Part of me says "ouch" but on the other hand I do feel it's different and might serve a purpose.

Thanks for all the constructive criticism so far!

Stinger's picture

Here's an updated image of a test with the crossbars connected. Any opinions?

eliason's picture

I'd try the /f/s a little farther apart before dismissing the idea. You're probably right that the /ft/ becomes unreadable as such.

Stinger's picture

I like them both - the rightmost version is too tight as you say. I could probably provide the other ones as alternatives. Or just make a stand and pick one :)

cerulean's picture

For this I'd say they could connect at the top or the crossbar, but not both. And the original unconnected ones really are the most effective for reading.

Stinger's picture

Thanks cerulean, that's a good point. I could upen up those /f/s at the top if i connect the crossbar. Leaning towards what you say though, keep the leftmost option as they seem somewhat more legible than the other ones - even though those on the right aren't that bad looking at all ;)

Stinger's picture

Here are some updated images of where I'm at now with the typeface changes:

daverowland's picture

tail in swash Q could do with being more like the leg of swash R - make it a smoother movement

daverowland's picture

I see it's about to be released. I think it could have done with a few more days in critique but I understand the desire to just get it out there! I've done the same thing recently with one of mine. It's so hard to know when they're 'finished' that you just want to release it and see what happens. Posters look great - good luck with it!

daverowland's picture

For what it's worth, I'd have the poster with the bird as the first one. It looks really good and shows more how the font would be used. I also see you've not made a flag yet. I've seen a few foundries do a flag that doesn't actually show the font. I think it's a clever way of getting people to click on the flag - just to see what it is, and I think your bird image could make an excellent flag. Of course, the only time anyone sees the flag without the font by its side is when it's a Hot New Font on the homepage, so I guess it has to be successful first before this marketing trick pays off!

Stinger's picture

Hey Dave,

thanks for all your feedback and comments! I was off for a few days, which is why I didn't respond any sooner. As you said, I'm quite eager to get it out there as this is my first typeface. If I understood correctly I can update the files with a newer version (some user feedback might help there too) and people will be able to download the newer version.

I've been struggling a bit with the tail of the Q, as I tried to follow the angle of the original dash (it's not a crossbar is it?). Might be better to move it downwards a bit (so maybe in the next update?).

Thanks for the feedback on the posters as well! Is there a way to set which one is the first? I bet there is. Might work very well to put the bird first. Most of the posters I did were just designed with "show the options" in mind, but in reality most people will probably use it more in the way as I did with the bird (so useful feedback there, thanks).

How did you see/know this by the way? Is there some secret way to see upcoming fonts at myfonts?

daverowland's picture

You can change the order of posters easily enough by going into the gallery section and dragging and dropping them into order.

Yeah, saw it on the staging site - you should have a link to it with the password in the email from MyFonts. It's where you go to check everything's working before it goes live.

Stinger's picture

Ha, pretty cool! Haven't received that link yet - I still need to send them a flag image. Might go with the bird as you suggested, although I'm leaning towards putting some type in there as well. Thanks man!

Stinger's picture

Hey Dave, got the link! Is it normal that you have to lookup the font by its name though? And dragging / dropping doesn't seem to work either. Am I missing something, is there a hidden menu or something like that? I'm not seeing any edit buttons or links either?

[have emailed myfonts as well but no reply just yet]

daverowland's picture

When they first go on the staging site they don't seem to be listed straight away in 'What's New?'.

To change the order of posters, make sure you are logged in, click on gallery (above poster, 2nd from left) and there you should be able to drag the posters up and down to change the order, and also add new posters, delete posters, and add any other files you might want to like pdf specimens or user guides.

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