Kerning on custom lettering for logo

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Luma Vine's picture
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Joined: 1 Jun 2010 - 1:16pm
Kerning on custom lettering for logo
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I made some custom lettering for this logo project, and this particular combination of letters is giving me a bit of trouble with kerning. Any points of improvement would be greatly appreciated.

*updated*

Alex Pankratov's picture
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Joined: 24 Nov 2008 - 11:50pm
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AV is too tight, EA is too loose.

THE and FOR is too loose, the rest is OK.

Luma Vine's picture
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Joined: 1 Jun 2010 - 1:16pm
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Thanks so much apankrat! I updated the image based on your suggestions. Looking better?

Craig Eliason's picture
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Joined: 19 Mar 2004 - 1:44pm
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AV still looks tight to me.

Luma Vine's picture
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Joined: 1 Jun 2010 - 1:16pm
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Thanks eliason! Updated again.

Tim Aarts's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2011 - 4:57pm
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I like your logo.

Actually V E looks a bit tight to me. Kern it reading only the top half of the word.

Luma Vine's picture
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Joined: 1 Jun 2010 - 1:16pm
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Hey Tim, I think you might be right, but could you say a bit more about the strategy of kerning WRT the top half? I think I understand what you are saying in this case, but I am not sure I get how the overall balance relies more heavily on the top half. Part of what I was struggling with in this design is that it first seemed like a tighter spacing was possible, but going looser overall really has helped overcome some of the particularly difficult areas. Still tweaking by tiny bits! Thanks for the help!

Tim Aarts's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2011 - 4:57pm
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When people read, they actually only read the top half of words. So in order for your logotype to be as legible as possible you should have a nice rhythm (optical spacing) between the top half of your letters.

It's a trick I learnt from watching Doyald Young's documentary, and it has worked pretty good for me.

Every type lover should see this documentary and therefore I have posted it on my blog: http://brandsandtypography.blogspot.com/2011/12/tweede-bericht.html

Great inspiration!

Tim Aarts's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2011 - 4:57pm
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The looser the spacing the more space you have to optically align letters. That's a given.

But I think in this case the looser spacing also fits the brand better.

Luma Vine's picture
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Joined: 1 Jun 2010 - 1:16pm
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Yea I am happy with the looser spacing. I have seen the documentary, and I do know about the tops of the letters being critical to reading. I always assumed that reading the tops was mostly a lowercase thing. But I think you are right about rhythm. I probably was focusing too much on trying to achieve even color and equal volume between letters. Anyhow, thanks for the help, I do feel this has improved greatly thanks to all your feedback! Thank you!

Tim Aarts's picture
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Joined: 13 Jul 2011 - 4:57pm
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It seems to work out in this case. Maybe some pro's can give their opinion about the subject?

Anyway I like the outcome. The leaven symbol is also great!

Theo T's picture
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Joined: 17 Dec 2011 - 9:50pm
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Nice logo! Yet, I believe there's still just a little too much space between the AV. (At first glance, the LEA and VEN rather look as though they're separate sections.)